I'm beginning to think he is on a deliberate wind up. A bit scary if he isn't. Reminds me of what I used to think 50 years ago so I find it uncomfortable reading.
Electioneering has started
- Thread starter Trashbat
- Start date
nibbles
Vital Football Hero
Lads, you can keep whining and making personal insults but at the end of the day it's because I've made several of you look utterly silly.
The number of times I asked questions you couldn't even answer.
Several of you gave your opinion if the UK could control it's borders and yet you don't even know the EU rules on Freedom of Movement. One guy tried claiming agreeing to a treaty removing control meant we had control. Even an eight year old would see the stupidity.
Please keep on with the personal insults, it just proves I'm right even more. If that's all you can say you obviously can't refute my points.
The number of times I asked questions you couldn't even answer.
Several of you gave your opinion if the UK could control it's borders and yet you don't even know the EU rules on Freedom of Movement. One guy tried claiming agreeing to a treaty removing control meant we had control. Even an eight year old would see the stupidity.
Please keep on with the personal insults, it just proves I'm right even more. If that's all you can say you obviously can't refute my points.
Vambogills
Vital Football Hero
I think what people are struggling with is that, if you were always right, then then common sense says that everyone would agree with what you say..
You never say, 'this is my just opinion'. You nearly always say 'I am right' and demean anyone who disagrees.
We all know someone who is obsessive about having the last word as they feel it must confirm they are right. It doesn't.
I’m not familiar enough with Andy Street’s politics to pass any real judgement in that respect, but it was at least refreshing to see a concession (and acceptance from Richard Parker) with a bit of dignity & maturity for a change.
Just highlights how utterly pathetic things have gotten that he’s getting praise from all corners for simply behaving like a grown up.
Vambogills
Vital Football Hero
Yep. Some decent, hard working people are going to lose their jobs as a direct result of the poor performance of the government and it's cabinet over recent years.
PuB
Vital 1st Team Regular
Street is a decent honest guy, he was largely expected to win because of his popularity in the West Midlands. Much more in the Rory Stewart brand of Tory than the Susan Hall’s of this world.
Both candidates full of praise for each other at the end, which as you say, was very refreshing.
RE Block 1
Vital Youth Team
Admonishing other people for using personal insults........then using personal insults, priceless!
nibbles
Vital Football Hero
Big own goal from Starmer.
Doesn’t stand for anything at all which seems to be a strategy.
Chances of me voting labour have significantly reduced following Elphicke’s acceptance.
There's plenty to be critical/suspect of here, but it is worth pointing out that she's not going to stand at the next election so it's not a case of her trying to keep her job or taking an existing labour candidate's place.
HullGills
Vital Reserves Team
Thanks,I didn't know that, so what she is doing is shi##ing on her party and constituents, that makes her look so much better!
HullGills
Vital Reserves Team
Labours Anneliese Dodds has said that deal has not been done, that is if you believe politicians of course.
Also denying that's the deal (should you choose to believe that)
Maybe there is some other yet-to-be-revealed deal, but for her part I suspect it's as much just a rat leaving the sinking ship and taking the opportunity to loudly put the boot into Sunak rather than just quietly standing down like so many others seem to be doing.
MedwayModernist
Vital Squad Member
It's very much the opposite of an own goal for Starmer.
Her statement has a few telling paragraphs in it...
“From small boats to biosecurity, Rishi Sunak’s government is failing to keep our borders safe and secure. Lives are being lost in the English Channel while small boat arrivals are once again at record levels. It’s clear they have failed to keep our borders secure and cannot be trusted.
“On housing, Rishi Sunak’s Government is now failing to build the homes we need. Last year saw the largest fall of new housing starts in England in a single year since the credit crunch. The manifesto committed to 300,000 homes next year - but only around half that number are now set to be built. Renters and leaseholders have been betrayed as manifesto pledges to end no-fault evictions and abolish ground rents have not been delivered as promised.
“The last couple of years have also seen a huge rise in homelessness, in temporary accommodation and rough sleeping - with record numbers of children now in temporary accommodation, without a secure roof over their head.
“Meanwhile Labour plan to build the homes we need, help young people onto the housing ladder and care about the vulnerable and homeless. That’s why I’m honoured to have been asked to work with Keir and the team to help deliver the homes we need.
“We need to move on from the broken promises of Rishi Sunak’s tired and chaotic Government. Britain needs a Government that will build a future of hope, optimism, opportunity and fairness. A Britain everyone can be part of, that will make the most of the opportunities that lie ahead. That’s why it’s time for change. Time for a Labour government led by Keir Starmer. The general election cannot come soon enough.”
Now, this is damning for Rishi Sunak and his current government, and is very much aimed at getting over the ilk of voter, who would typically be your working class tory/reform voter. You win elections by getting people from the opposition to see your point of view.
A chap called Andrew Levi did a thread last night, which pretty much sums it up perfectly.
Andrew Levi
@AndrewPRLevi
While understanding the surprise (it was unexpected!) at Natalie Elphicke’s defection, I’m bemused by the shock, in some quarters, that Keir Starmer welcomed her.No, not because Sir Keir is a “Red Tory” or a “short-term opportunist”.His grand strategy explains it.
Starmer’s Labour is on a mission, even if some in the party don’t yet realise, to make Labour *the* party of Britain, embedding it in government for decades.Creating a national consensus, drawing in the widest feasible span of committed supporters.
The purpose is to transform the country (more on that in a moment).“Doing an Attlee”.But succeeding.(Before you raise both eyebrows, consider this: what might Attlee & his colleagues have achieved if Labour had been in power a lot longer?). /3.
You can’t do that just by attracting & retaining voters from “the centre ground”. You need many of those flirting with the extremes to join you & stick with you. /4.
MPs are a different matter from voters, of course.Their views are public.Voters’ views are (generally) secret: only shown to the ballot paper, in the privacy of the polling booth. /5
Any defecting MP is vulnerable to (very obvious) political attack.Voters can defect without embarrassment (except perhaps toward their previous selves) or personal disadvantage. /6.
Starmer needs the voters for his grand strategy to succeed.The strategic value of a defecting MP is the signal that sends. /7.
The Elphicke defection tells voters tempted by, or actually voting for, Reform & the like that it’s OK to vote Labour.A centrist Tory MP defecting to Labour would send a similar message to voters otherwise tempted to support the LibDems, say. /8.
Naturally, Starmer’s Great British Party strategy carries risks.Will a particular defection backfire?Will he lose existing supporters?Will his political message to voters be too unclear to cut through?Can he hold together the extraordinary coalition he’s attempting? /9.
But, contrary to his image, Sir Keir is a bold revolutionary. (I know, I know: that’s precisely my point. Look more closely. You don’t have to agree with him, but it’s best to understand him).It would be safer just to go for a decent GE win. That isn’t his approach. /10.
Beneath the perhaps superficially bland sounding Labour Party official strategy there are in clear sight, if you care to read them, the signs of the drive to create the Great British Party & put it in power for the long term. /11.
I’ll just list the headlines here:
Strong, stable and secure foundations
The rock of economic stability
Strong national defence
Secure borders
On these foundations, a long term plan to get Britain’s future back via five fully funded national missions -
Get Britain building again
Switch on Great British Energy
Get the NHS back on its feet
Take back our streets
Break down barriers to opportunity /13.
So, a final thought:
Which of those three “foundations” & five “national missions” do you think voters inclined to support an MP like Natalie Elphicke, or a party like Reform, would be willing to get behind, or at least consider favourably?My answer? All of them. /14. End
Whisky Gill
Vital Youth Team
Or could Natalie be a plant to cause friction in the Labour Party? Seems to be happening anyway. ( Puts tin foii hat back on and leaves the room)
